FR#47: Discussion of Frame and Ego Destruction
#46: Three Rough Nights
Rufio, Dark Nes, and I hit up Hipster Joint at 10:30. No one is around, so we chill, dance a bit. Dark spies an Asian two set across the way. He tends not to do Asians, so I do it. "Hey, you guys look fun," Dark tells me to say.
I walk up, sit down, and open with that line. "We're a little bored sitting over there waiting for things to heat up. Join us and talk a bit." They comply.
Rufio chats up Tall while Dark Nes and I chat up Small. The conversation is going well and I am escalating, but then I try to get them to dance and they refuse. Dark dances with two girls, then a few minutes later, he pulls one of them up to dance. The venue is heating up, but I am feeling chody because of the refusal. I move around and open a set or two, but nothing sticks. I come back and dance with the girls. Dark and Rufio dance with both girls where as I just keep my distance. I feel that the girls are starting to realize I have lost my balls and it just paralyzes me. The whole night is very painful.
To make matters worse, around 11:00, Neko calls. "It has been a long time," she says. She wants to see me again. I tell her to come to my place tonight, but she says she is tired. She commutes very far everyday and does not have much time to sleep, so that's fine. She is finishing her work, though, and will hopefully soon be working in Manhattan again. Still, I am disappointed.
Around 12:30, Dark bounces and number closes one of the girls. I immediately try to number close and the girl just turns away. I leave after that feeling absolutely terrible, wanting to quit PU, wondering why I'm doing all this stuff, and all those negative thoughts. On a separate plane of emotion, however, I am happy. I know that this is the feeling of my ego giving way to a more realistic self.
Dark suggested that I stop putting a minimum on my daily approaches and that I concentrate on mid-game now. I would agree, but the past three days have been tough in terms of approaching. I still need to do it, but now I will put more emphasis on results in the way of five number closes per day.
An FR by Alchemist on Negativity
About three weeks ago, I ran into this girl that my friend had tried to set me up with a while back at a friends party. She was negative, rude and had the wrong read on me. I was, for the first time in quite a while, angry and upset about the situation. I channeled this into the intention that I was going to find a hotter, smarter Asian girl and I declared to my wing that I wasn’t going home until I found her. I was ready to wander Chinatown if need be after the clubs closed – that’s how serious I was.
So we go to our favorite club right after (around 12:30). My intention and motivation is the highest its been in a while. And so I stumble upon an Asian sorority night there.
Actually… it’s one of the worst nights yet, far more guys than girls and very few Asian women. It’s not like the universe always cooperates. Having set my intent, I skip alcohol and go for red bull – gaming without any liquid courage. I get blown off during a few sets quickly. It’s more of a combative atmosphere there… too many guys and girls shell up and huddle.
At around one, I see a hot Asian girl in a white tank-top with great breasts standing at a table with her friend.
I want to go… but… I’m better when I stand still and they pass by, or at the bar, or when I’m walking and can casually stop by, or on the dance floor. Anything but having to just walk right up to a girl, in front of everybody nonetheless… I could write out a whole essay on why not to approach her – why the situation wasn’t cooperating. But my wing tells me to, and we have a rule to never say no to your wing. And I don’t.
My heart flutters, I’m nervous, I don’t normally feel like this, I don’t have anything to say. I slide up on her side and say the truth, “hi, I noticed you and think you are really cute and had to say hi.”
She drops her panties and says, take me now!
Actually… she barely responds and is quite quiet for the first few moments. I could eject and save the awkwardness of her walking away. But I don’t – in part because it was so damn hard to work up the nerve to approach - and she starts asking questions.
Her friend coming over checking up on her a few times and I think she’s trying to “save her.” In actuality, she’s trying to be saved from this guy that insists upon buying her drinks and invading her personal space (she refused his drinks – gotta love the hot-blooded Latina). We start talking too and she hands me a Red Bull Vodka..
I’m in… mission accomplished… my anger towards the negative nancy that fueled this night is replaced with gratitude. She’s not just hotter, but also very smart. We bounce to another spot and I’m ready to take her home. And she comes, but her friend does too and her friend is too drunk and needs to be taken care of. So they both leave.
I don’t even get a goodnight kiss – just a hurried goodbye… not sure what to think until she texts me and says she had a great night.
From there, it’s easy… I text her to meet up with me and we walk around town. She seems like she comes from a conservative family and at one point, I wonder if she is a virgin. But it would be easy to dwell on that and I chose not – why bother believing something if it is not empowering.
We go back to my place. We are having nerdy math talk and I move closer and closer, lean into her and start making out then take her upstairs and get her shirt off (and I get naked). She says, “no, no” as I try to take her pants off. It’s a no that I know she means. I tell her, “hey, no pressure at all, let’s just enjoy each others company.”
The next time, I see her and we repeat and I’m dry humping her before she gives me a “no” that I know she doesn’t want to. She’s having her period and the next time I see her, it is literally a 16 hour marathon of explosive sex and sleep. Yoga did her body well and it was some of the best sex I have ever had..
This experience has taught me a profound lesson – it is much, much easier to chose the more negative and limiting mindset and thus not take action than it is to take action.
It is much easier to say, “it won’t work, I’m not going to approach” than it is to say, “it might work, but I’ll try anyway” or “it’s worth it either way!” That said, I don’t remember how many or what girls turned me down that night even though I was sober. I forgot about it right after it happened. And even if I got shot down brutally, why does it matter if it won’t change how I feel about myself? After meeting her, I woke up the next morning thinking about how much I would have regretted not approaching her.
If there was a room of nasty strangers and one had a small pot of gold that they’d give to the first who asked, would you walk up to everybody and ask knowing that most would look at you like you were absolutely crazy? Of course you would! So why are we so hesitant to walk up to beautiful and generally pleasant women and strike up a conversation or compliment them on how they caught your eye knowing full well that you may share something much better than a little metal? Its irrational.
The next aspect of this is that its also much easier to think less of ourselves or a situation than it is to take a bolder, more empowering mindset. I could very easily of said – at multiple points – she’s not interested and walked away. I could have believed that she was conservative and not gone for sex.
And the final aspect comes back to what started it all – the negative nancy. It was quite easy and natural to get upset about it. But I was glad that I channeled that negativity into something that I really want. I don’t want to spend a weekend night angry – I want to spend it with the company of someone awesome, and was glad that I did.
So anywho – hope that I didn’t sound preachy or overly-philosophical, but I am beginning to see the new possibilities that come from refusing to take the easier, lower negative road.
#45: The Effects of Alcohol and My Second 10 Second Kiss
FR#44: False Negs and Ego Issues
Alchemist RE: FR#33
Written by Alchemist on the Vibe Society forums, an NYC local group, in regards to my second failed LR with Neko:
Sparrow,
I think the key with strip clubs is to just go when it is not that busy. And if you can, bring girls. The strippers are usually refreshed by the chance to talk with normal guys rather than fat, dirty old men grunting at them.
As for Neko – do you know anything about her sexual past? Having dated, and currently dating, a girl from China, I know that many are virgins or have very different views of sex than the typical American girl that the “game” was designed to bed.
And on the note of getting them to bed, a few thoughts as I have tried all the approaches you mentioned.
First and foremost, it is absolutely essential to LEAD. That’s pretty much the core truth of pick-up, as the man you lead the girl. Be alpha, masculine and when the time is ready, start expressing your sexuality more. I always try to guide the girl through multiple venues, physically guide her, make the choices, etc…
Next most important is being HONEST. Listen to any angry love song and it always deals with one of two things – a guy lying to her or making long-term promises and commitments based on short-term feelings (which eventually crumble when the spark is lost). A girl has a read on you pretty quickly and its not that hard to express who you are… a lot of the wait just comes from her feeling you out to see if you are going to promise what you deliver. No girl wants to be led down the relationship road only to have the brakes turn on as soon as you have sex. And I’ve regrettably done that – not intentionally – but because I was horny (and needy), wanted sex and didn’t really care that much about the girl.
This still happens sometimes with random girls (in that I want sex but don’t care about them), but I make sure to not do anything that would signal a relationship. I intentionally try to come off as more of a player, as someone with lots of women, so that they don’t even consider me as a potential relationship. And escalate FAST. But again, all I am trying to do is get them to say “yes or no,” to make a choice between sex or not, and either blow me or blow me off. I am not going to waste more than a night on a girl like that.
Anyway, onto your specific ideas because it sounds that you clearly care about this girl:
#1 – Yes, stronger early game (which is pretty much leading as a man and being honest)
#2 – Role reversal. I’ve tried doing the “I don’t want to have sex too soon.” It’s complete and utter bullshit and it rightfully will rarely, if ever, work with a reasonably intelligent woman. If you are being the alpha, sexual male, she knows that you want to fuck her…
#3 – Plowing… When a girl says, “I shouldn’t have sex with you” she is arguing with herself not you. She wants you inside her… I’ve never had a girl say that and not have sex. The argument is her mind vs. her body and you can say, “yes, we are naughty” or “we are bad for each other” as you continue to escalate (read her body language… if she’s spreading her legs and arching her hips, she’s asking for it). But be careful to tell the difference between token and real resistance…
#4 – Freezing out… It’s actually pretty cruel and I tried it once and it worked. But I regretted doing it and it is quite manipulative. When I have sex with a girl that I care about, I don’t want it to have been tainted with any manipulation.
About a year ago, I had an encounter with a Korean girl. I was not needy, but I tried to plow through her resistance. She said no, and from then on the guards were up… she wouldn’t get comfortable in my place or give me another opportunity to really escalate. It went no where…
What I found works best is to sincerely respect her while being a sexual yet not-needy male. If she says she doesn’t want to have sex and means it (not the token resistance), than I would say, “I respect you and I would never pressure you to do something that you are not ready for.” You can still escalate the next time you see her, but she knows that you will stop when she wants you to without you freezing her out, arguing or pressuring her.
That is it… no apologies or justifications for being sexual, no expectations on her. And when you think about it that is really what is fair. She does not have the right to expect a relationship from you. And you do not have the right to expect sex from her. Just enjoy your time together and let it evolve from there. And from what I have experienced, this alone will make her drop her barriers the next time you see her and let you in.
This is pretty much the approach that I use with every girl that I care about (if I don’t care about them, and I try to avoid those types of girls, I just put my sexuality out there and make her do one thing – make an one-time CHOICE between having sex or not. I respect it either way).
#43: The Power of Canned Material
FR#42: The NRPS Incident and My 4th K Close
FR#41: Wall Slam Girl, Bollywood Romance, and the Magic of Negging
FR#40: My First (Four) Slaps and the Angry Lesbians OR the Blitzkreig Begins
FR#39: Japanese Omelets and Sexy Marines
FR#38: Jiujitsu Dance Gambits = Blow Out
FR#37: Two Chileans and an Angry Southerner
FR#36: Two Belgians and a Lot of Koreans
FR#35: Sexiest Party Yet and General Gushing
FR#34: Peruvian Japanese and the Extreme Sport of Wall Slamming
FR#33: My First Strip Club and My Second Failed LR
The third solution is to make the girl incredibly horny, continue plowing as she resists, but when you hit major resistance, you do a freeze out. You can do a soft or hard freeze out.
